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Subject: More about the intials ...
A believer in code 19 wrote: > What I mentioned were simple *facts* (I did not make any "analysis") What you mentioned are five(5)19-divisible sets of initials and what you DID NOT MENTION are EIGHT(8)or nine(9)sets that ARE NOT 19 DIVISIBLE, which proves that "initials" have nothing to do with code 19. IF IT WAS GOD`S INTENTION to code quran, ALL of 14 sets of initials would be 19 divisible.
The Quran consists of altogether 29 initialed suras which contain just about half the text of the entire Quran.
Of the 29 suras 17 are divisible individually. The remaining 12 suras are divisble when grouped together with other suras with the same intials. One such group would the H.M. suras, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, and 46. When counting all the H's and all the M's in these six suras, the total comes to 2147, or 19x113.
One of these suras, sura 42, have two initialed verses. It is the only sura in the whole Quran which as this:
[42:1] H. M.*
[42:2] `A. S. Q.*
The intials in the second verse occurs in the sura 98, 54 and 57 times respectively. This adds up to 209, or 19x11.
For those who wish to study the miracle further, you can do so at: http://www.submission.info/quran/miracle/index.html
There is always room for people to dispute proofs. This is part of the design.
What is most astonishing with these powerful proofs is the emphasis that people spend on trying to discredit them while claiming to support the Quran, when all this proof does is exactly that, support the Quran.
What you will consistently find however is that every single one who disputes the miracle of the Quran, also disputes part of the message in the Quran, whether they admit to it first or not. They either insist on associating someone else with God, or they insist that we need other sources besides the Quran to be guided.
Another source besides the Quran would be something which preaches something which is not supported by or which contradicts the Quran. it would be something which adds rites to the religion which is not instituted by God in the Quran.
[5:48] Then we revealed to you this scripture, truthfully, confirming previous scriptures, and superseding them. You shall rule among them in accordance with GOD's revelations, and do not follow their wishes if they differ from the truth that came to you. For each of you, we have decreed laws and different rites. Had GOD willed, He could have made you one congregation. But He thus puts you to the test through the revelations He has given each of you. You shall compete in righteousness. To GOD is your final destiny - all of you - then He will inform you of everything you had disputed.
You says that bismilahs are consistently included in letter counts and participate in structure. BUT, it ONLY refers to five(5) 19-divisible sets and in regards other 8 EIGHT sets that are not divisible, it is the same whether you include them or not they ARE NOT 19 divisible. (You again fail to mention sets that are not 19 divisible. This a kind of disease of believes in the code. Whatever is not 19 divisible they do not mention it.)
Although there are several suras that contain the same initials, such as the 6 A.L.M. suras, they are all divisible individually. There are two sets of suras which only produce multiples of 19 when counted in a group. They are the H.M. suras as described above and also the H., T.H., T.S., and T.S.M. suras. To study this more, visit: http://www.submission.info/quran/miracle/index.html
Not to mention that there are other numerous ways of analising initials, for example: *When counted alone/separately,ONLY one(1)* out of 14 quranic initials shows 19 divisibility in initialed surahs (notice that this is separate count of initials in chapters where they occur/crown the chapter-for example- count of letter Q in all initialed chapters where it crowns the chapter is 114=6 ×19 -the count is19 divisible, BUT, it is the only initial which shows 19 divisibility when initials are analysed in this way!!!) (This,you`ll agree, for sure do not represent any code.)
There are two suras which contains the letter Q. That is Sura 42 and Sura 57. They each contain 57 Q's. 57 is 19x3, and 57 + 57 = 114, which is 19x6, obviously, but it is also the number of chapters in the Quran. Are you willing to disregard this as nothing? The following are some more information about these two specific suras. Information extracted from "Quran: The Final Testament" by Rashad Khalifa.
THE QURANIC INITIAL "Q" (Qaaf)
The computer data showed that the text of the only Q-initialed suras, 42 and 50, contained the same number of Q's, 57 and 57. That was the first hint that a deliberate mathematical system might exist in the Quran.
Sura 50 is entitled "Q," prefixed with "Q," and the first verse reads, "Q, and the glorious Quran." This indicated that "Q" stands for "Quran," and the total number of Q's in the two Q-initialed suras represents the Quran's 114 suras (57+57 = 114 = 19x6). This idea was strengthened by the fact that "the Quran" occurs in the Quran 57 times.
The Quran is described in Sura "Q" as "Majid" (glorious), and the Arabic word "Majid" has a gematrical value of 57: M (40) + J (3) + I (10) + D (4) = 57.Sura 50 consists of 45 verses, and 50 + 45 = 95, same total as in Sura 42.
By counting the letter "Q" in every "Verse 19" throughout the Quran, the total count comes to 76, 19x4. Here is a summary of the Q-related data:1. The frequency of occurrence of "Q" in Sura "Q" (No. 50) is 57, 19x3.
2. The letter "Q" occurs in the other Q-initialed sura (No. 42) exactly the same number of times, 57.3. The total occurrence of the letter "Q" in the two Q-initialed suras is 114, which equals the number of suras in the Quran.
4. "The Quran" is mentioned in the Quran 57 times.
5. The description of the Quran as "Majid" (Glorious) is correlated with the frequency of occurrence of the letter "Q" in each of the Q-initialed suras.
6. The word "Majid" has a gematrical value of 57.
7. Sura 42 consists of 53 verses, and 42 + 53 is 95, or 19x5.8. Sura 50 consists of 45 verses, and 50 + 45 is also 95, 19x5.
9. The number of Q's in all verses numbered "19" throughout the Quran is 76, 19x4.
*Only three(3)* out of 29 initialed surahs show 19 divisible sum of "initials" that crown particular chapter.
17 of the 29 initialled suras show divisible sums in their respective suras.
(This is apsolutely normal statistical variation and this can not, , constitute any code, and not to speak about DIVINE CODE and PROOF of divinity of the Quran.)
Well, if that was correct, you would be right. This is what Rashad Khalifa, who discovered the code, invited people to come up with one single mistake during the 20 years he spent researching this and spreading the news, but nobody could come up with even one.
This is why many in the traditional Muslim world do preach that there is a code 19 in the Quran, but instead try to reduce its importance to their followers, stating that it is 'just another sign that the Quran is from God' while keeping them in the dark about its real message.
*Only four(4)* out of 30 sets of quranic initials shows 19-divisible sum of "initials" that crown particular chapter.
30 sets? Have you actually looked at the facts surrounding the mathematical miracle of the Quran? Please see the data presented above.
For those of you who wish to study this for yourselves before making up your minds, as God commands (17:36), please visit: http://www.submission.info/quran/miracle/index.html
The commentar is same as above.(Data/counts are taken from Abu Jamil - An authority among believers in the code from www.q-zone.com)
An authority among believers in the code? Strange, we never heard of this guy!
The only authority we recognize is God Almighty, as preached by Him in all His scriptures, including His final scripture to the world, the Quran.
Rashad Khalifa who discovered the miracle and was the first to spread news about it to the world has never claimed or suggesting anything remotely related to this invented 'authority' you point to?
For those who wish to familiarize yourselves with what Rashad Khalifa discovered and preached, please visit: www.submission.info. You can order his books from www.masjidtucson.org, or through www.Amazon.com
IF GOD`S INTENTION WAS TO EMBEDE A CODE IN QURAN, IT WOULD BE A PIECE OF CAKE for All-Mighty Creator of the Universe TO MAKE ALL THE SUMS in ALL these different ways of analysis 19-divisible.And THAT WOULD BE A DIVINE CODE and that would be a proof !!!
You are right. And He did.
[74:30] Over it is nineteen.*
Some of the Simple Facts.
The first revelation of the Quran (96:1-5) consisted of 19 words and 76 letters (19x4).
The first sura revealed, Sura 96, consists of 19 verses and 304 Arabic letters (19x16).
The first sura revealed, sura 96, sits on top of the last 19 suras. 114 (1), 113 (2), 112 (3), 111 (4), 110 (5), 109 (6), 108 (7), 107 (8), 106 (9), 105 (10), 104 (11), 103 (12), 102 (13), 101 (14), 100 (15), 99 (16), 98 (17), 97 (18), 96 (19).
Basamalah (In the name of God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful) consists of 19 letters. The four words that consistute this statement occur in the whole Quran in multiples of 19. Ism (19 times), Allah (2698, 19x142), Rahman (57 times, 19x3), Raheem (114 times, 19x6).
When you utter "The Key", the sura you recite for your prayer each day, your lips touch exactly 19 times.
The Quran has 114 chapters, 19x6.
The Quran has 6346 verses, 19x334.
The word God (Allah) occurs in the Quran 2698 times (19x142) and when you add the verse numbers in which all these occurrences are found, it adds up to 118123, or 19x6217.
He would not left us to relie on false data, conjectures and ignorance of math. and statistics of code fanatics.
Thank God we all have the freedom to decide for ourselves, what is considered ignorance and code fanatics, and is not at the mercy of people who spread false information about this amazing code which proves beyond all reasonable doubts that the Quran has been perfectly preserved according to God's promise (15:9). Not only that, God's true religion has been authenticated, as preached by all His prophets and all His messengers, namely that we shall worship Him alone. This is what disturbs the disbelievers who seek to keep people in the dark to promote the worship and reverence of other entities and beings, or to maintain some kind of status for themselves.
[2:135] They said, "You have to be Jewish or Christian, to be guided." Say, "We follow the religion of Abraham - monotheism - he never was an idol worshiper."
[6:161] Say, "My Lord has guided me in a straight path - the perfect religion of Abraham, monotheism. He never was an idol worshiper."
[6:162] Say, "My Contact Prayers (Salat), my worship practices, my life and my death, are all devoted absolutely to GOD alone, the Lord of the universe.
I WOULD ACCEPT a code as divine **EVEN** IF ONLY ONE out of numerous different (but consistent) methods of analysing initials COULD RESULT IN ALL 19-divisible summs/sets.
A suggestion to you in that case. Actually take a look at the code for yourself. From the 'data' you present above, it is evident that you have not, but have relied on what other people have been telling you about the code, who most most evidently are not conveying to you or others the correct facts.
For anyone interested in taking their own minds, hearing and eyesight seriously, please visit: http://www.submission.info/quran/miracle/index.html
BUT, people investigate count, calculate, analyse and check during 30 years and they tried all the methods of analysis and counting and whole spectar of various exclusions and inclusions and what did they find is ONLY FIVE(5) out of 14 sets ????? And even this is only if include letter from bismilahs for which they claim that ARE NOT part of surahs but only preceed them and which they excluded when they counted words in Quran(what a consistency!!!).
Again, you need to look at the facts for yourself. It is clear that you have not. You have referred to the Quran as having 19, 14 and 30 sets of initials only in this article. Which is it?
The Quran has two sets of initials which produce multiples of 19 when clustered together in accordance with their initials.
Such a slopy code can not be a result of DIVINE design. It looks divine to you because of your prejudice that there is a code in Quran. Besides that... You only CONJECTURE that Alif initlaled sets will be 19 divisible one day. You have no knowledge about it and God did not revealed anything about it to you. According Abu Jamil datas ONLY ONE out of four alif sets are 19 divisible.
According to Abu Jamil...well, Abu Jamil has not done his homework. And apparently neither have you. What will you say on the Day of Judgement when asked about why you rejected the Quran's proof of authenticity by God. Will you say, "But, Abu Jamil said...." OR will you study the code for yourself so you can with confidence answer one way or the other.
Regarding letters(or sets)Nun and Sad. They are NOT 19 divisible.
So, again the only argument you can offer is your opinion, without backing it up with any solid data. And yet, you are so sure.
You are free to correct them in Quran based on your conjecture, but ,even then, there is no code. But you have to know that from the moment when you start to correct texts and to pick and choose from various scripts to repare your hallucinated code- it, by definition, could not be called a divine code and design, but human`s code and design.
The argument again is, 'you are doing this or that and you are wrong, wrong, wrong', without producing any solid data to back up your statements. Do you wish people to take your word for it!?
Our suggestion is that you visit the following site and/or order or download the material produced by Rashad Khalifa for free on the following site: www.submission.info.
You can also see most of his produced videos at: www.video.google.com, search for Rashad Khalifa. This way you can study this matter for yourself.
A word of warning though: If you are disturbed by the notion of worshipping God Alone, and that idols such as the prophets and saints are just powerless entities which cannot help or harm you, then you may feel some nausea watching these videos.
One day you will surely find a way, using different texts, to make all sets 19 divisible. But you have to know that I(human) COULD PRODUCE AND DESIGN "quranic code" BASED ON ANY NUMBER IF i am allowed to pick and to choose from various scripts and texts of Quran as you.
If your accusation was true, there would certainly be reason to doubt the code. However, the code is extremely consistent and extremely sensitive to any tampering of any kind. As demonstrated above in some of the simple facts, there is an overwhemling straightforwardness, clarity and consistency in the code for those who can see. http://www.submission.info/quran/miracle/simplefacts.html
God is fully aware of your challenge.
Mathematical Challenge
[2:23] If you have any doubt regarding what we revealed to our servant,* then produce one sura like these, and call upon your own witnesses against GOD, if you are truthful.
Again, if there is a code in Quran God in his fuly detailed book would not fail to mention it(specialy becuse of reasons mentioned above). Since He did not, you only conjecture. And twist the verses to justify your hallucinated code. On the end, i recommend to you, as well to other believers in code a basic courses in:1 Arabic 2 Statistics Plus, 3 Reading and meditating upon Quran. But of course, previously you have to take RK`s glasses off.
You have spent a lot of time and effort in this article to discredit the code. Yet you have failed to give even one example of a practice or principle preached by those who support the Quran and its miracle which you claim is not Quranic. Why is that?
We invite you to undertake our challenge on this site, to come up with practices or principles preached by Rashad Khalifa which you deem unQuranic. We promise to publish your challenge and your views in full together with our response, as we have done here. To send in a challenge, please visit the following page: